IMPORTANT...Refute if you can.

I put a lot of links up of videos to show that God exists and I just wanted to make a serperate thread.

IMPORTANT VIDEO:

You have to watch this.


After you've watched all these, then go ahead and argue.

Well I've just watched most of each video, and I can't say I was impressed especially after seeing venomfangx be destroyed several times in A rebuttal I probably am hitting a brick wall, but can you at least present the scientific side of this debate? Plus, what Hebrew school kicks a 7 yr old out for being atheist?

whenhen wrote:Well I've just watched most of each video, and I can't say I was impressed especially after seeing venomfangx be destroyed several times in A rebuttal I probably am hitting a brick wall, but can you at least present the scientific side of this debate? Plus, what Hebrew school kicks a 7 yr old out for being atheist?

The video he got smashed for was a stupid stupid video and it didnt explain anything about evolution being wrong, so that I admit. I didnt post that video though. You didnt prove any of these videos wrong though. Obviously, a very HORRIBLE Hebrew School. God wouldn't want that to happen. He would've wanted people to try and help him find God.

God is your conscience. God is not a living form of matter that creates miracles. I believe in most of the morals that the presence of God creates, but I do not believe he is an actual thing that watches over us. I refuse to believe I am put on this world to serve them. If you believe in something other than God you go to hell? I don't take too many classes on politics, but I do believe that is communism.

whenhen wrote:Well I've just watched most of each video, and I can't say I was impressed especially after seeing venomfangx be destroyed several times in A rebuttal I probably am hitting a brick wall, but can you at least present the scientific side of this debate? Plus, what Hebrew school kicks a 7 yr old out for being atheist?

and to be honest that actually.. video was stupid. they wouldnt let him finish his statements and were basing their explanations on questions back at him and mostly false information or information that could easily be disproved.

P2 wrote:You have to watch this.


After you've watched all these, then go ahead and argue.

this guy is an idiot. he quoted scripture written after jesus' execution as fulfilling a prophecy

Videos by stupid people for stupid people. I'm not saying anything about whether or not god exists, but everyone in these videos is small minded and can't accept there are things they can't understand, so they think making ONE small jump and saying God is the ONLY thing that breaks the rules that govern our universe makes them REALLY FUCKING SMART.

I'm hesitant to get involved in alot of these debates because I hate how long they get and I'm sure my response will be plenty long..and I'll feel like I'm rambling and later realize I've said something stupid but here goes...

I haven't watched all of those videos yet because I don't have the time right now so I'll finish later...But it seems every time somebody tries to argue Creationism v.s. Evolution they bring in the big bang theory...They are COMPLETELY different theories. The Big Bang Theory is the theory of the beginning of the universe. Evolution is the theory of how SPECIES become what they are (speciation).

Creationism and Evolutions are not even theories on the same topic either. Creationism is a theory on the CREATION (I know amazing, right?) and Evolution, as the etymology of the word would suggest is a theory on CHANGE. Evolution contradicts creationism because the bible essentially says that man, sheep, goat, whatever species all came 'right out of the box'..but creationism does not contradict evolution, because they are theories on different topics in the first place.. the only catch being if creationism is/was true evolution could not be possible.

There are theories of how life began that branch off of evolution, but since there isn't even an entirely agreed upon theory of the begining of life within the scientific community...and there never will be...

Answering the question how life began is IMPOSSIBLE. You can prove that it COULD have happened one way or another, but you can't prove it DID happen any given way since nobody was around when it began. Since we have record of how life has changed and became what it is and can actually see how life slowly changes over time since evolution is a constant process we can provide evidence to make fact.

CT Track wrote:God is your conscience. God is not a living form of matter that creates miracles. I believe in most of the morals that the presence of God creates, but I do not believe he is an actual thing that watches over us. I refuse to believe I am put on this world to serve them. If you believe in something other than God you go to hell? I don't take too many classes on politics, but I do believe that is communism.

no it'd be a dictatorship. but our dictator loves us so much that he was willing to put himself in a human body and get tortured just so he wouldn't have to live without us. show me a dictator that loves you so much to do that.

SourWorms wrote:

P2 wrote:You have to watch this.


After you've watched all these, then go ahead and argue.

this guy is an idiot. he quoted scripture written after jesus' execution as fulfilling a prophecy

i can't see the vids, so idk what scripture that was, but i read somewhere that in all, Jesus fulfilled 33 OT prophesies. what's the chance of that?

i loved those first two videos....ya i cant see them

ok... I could only watch the 1st 2 videos b/c I don't have any speakers... so if I missed any audio in the 1st two... oops... but here're my thoughts... I'll sort of go in order. I took notes as I watched.

1st Video:

Starts saying that something can't come from nothing... ok I agree, it doesn't make sense. So then it claims that the only possibility is that something has always existed. Well, forgive my misunderstanding, but isn't that just as hard to believe? So then it says that God must be outside of time, space, and matter to have always existed because time, space, and matter are finite. The problem with this is... how can you prove that they are finite? Have you actually seen the end of space? have you been anywhere completely devoid of matter in all directions? Have you seen the beginning or end of time? the answer is no. Therefore the assertion that logically God has always existed outside of space, matter, and time is not proven... rather it SEEMS to YOU to be the most logical option. But understand that for the reasons I just stated, it might not seem as logical to others.

One argument given that time is finite is that there could not have been an infinate amount of changes until now. Why? I can grasp that at some point every possible combination would have existed, but why couldn't it just start over? or keep reshuffling the same random combinations that have already happened?

Another thing... it says that this eternal existence is the one God... it seems to indicate the Christian God by showing a picture of a bible. Well, first of all, how can you prove that there is only one God? 2nd of all, if there is only one God, then obviously several major groups of people have it wrong. Because although Christians, Jews, and Muslims worship the same God, there are huge differences in beliefs. So how do you know that the Muslims or Jews aren't following God's message the closest? And don't say it's because of morals. Morals don't come from religion. I used to be an atheist and I still knew right from wrong. And I know several atheists who definately know right from wrong.

The fact that many OT prophecies came true is not solid evidence. I believe most ancient cultures have records of people accurately telling the future.

Lastly, that statement "was there always a yesterday?" while it is hard to grasp this concept, it goes back to my first point... it's just as hard for me to grasp the concept of there always being a yesterday as the concept of there being an eternal being above space, time, and matter. Obviously one of them is more logical to you. To me, neither is logical. And there is no proof that either one is true... this is only philosophy, and I should remind everyone that ideas arrived at through philosophy are theories. Not actually proven. Because how many times have you seen something that you thought was one thing and turned out to be something else entirely?
I accept the fact that I do not know, will not learn until I die, or possibly may never know.

ProtestTheZero wrote:Videos by stupid people for stupid people. I'm not saying anything about whether or not god exists, but everyone in these videos is small minded and can't accept there are things they can't understand, so they think making ONE small jump and saying God is the ONLY thing that breaks the rules that govern our universe makes them REALLY FUCKING SMART.

i hate to agree with you

*sg* wrote: The problem with this is... how can you prove that they are finite? Have you actually seen the end of space? have you been anywhere completely devoid of matter in all directions? Have you seen the beginning or end of time? the answer is no. Therefore the assertion that logically God has always existed outside of space, matter, and time is not proven... rather it SEEMS to YOU to be the most logical option. But understand that for the reasons I just stated, it might not seem as logical to others.
many scientists believe that there is an end to space, and outside of it is antimatter.

Another thing... it says that this eternal existence is the one God... it seems to indicate the Christian God by showing a picture of a bible. Well, first of all, how can you prove that there is only one God? 2nd of all, if there is only one God, then obviously several major groups of people have it wrong. Because although Christians, Jews, and Muslims worship the same God, there are huge differences in beliefs. So how do you know that the Muslims or Jews aren't following God's message the closest? And don't say it's because of morals. Morals don't come from religion. I used to be an atheist and I still knew right from wrong. And I know several atheists who definately know right from wrong.
Because muslims worship a dead god with no power, and the jews are waiting for the coming of a great king that has already come. I agree morals don't come from God. there are plenty of good atheists. but not in God's eyes.
The fact that many OT prophecies came true is not solid evidence. I believe most ancient cultures have records of people accurately telling the future.
It isn't.

Lastly, that statement "was there always a yesterday?" while it is hard to grasp this concept, it goes back to my first point... it's just as hard for me to grasp the concept of there always being a yesterday as the concept of there being an eternal being above space, time, and matter. Obviously one of them is more logical to you. To me, neither is logical. And there is no proof that either one is true... this is only philosophy, and I should remind everyone that ideas arrived at through philosophy are theories. Not actually proven. Because how many times have you seen something that you thought was one thing and turned out to be something else entirely?
I accept the fact that I do not know, will not learn until I die, or possibly may never know.
You'll learn right after you die.

All in all, i don't believe there is proof for, or against God. that's why He leaves it up to faith.

I agree with everything above has said meok

ATribeCalledGreg wrote:Who cares? Quit pushing your beliefs on others. You can't prove there is a God just like I can't prove there is an invisible talking black polar bear right behind me. The fact of the matter is that religion has been a powerful tool used by many political figures to manipulate their people. Like one comedian said, there is supposedly a little man in the sky with ten things he doesn't want you to do, and if you do you will burn and be tortured and go through eternal anguish for ever and ever and ever.... but he loves you and he needs money.

I'm not saying there isn't a God. I'm not saying there is. I'm saying it's pointless to argue about this now. If you are so sure you are right, just wait until we all die so you can do your "told you so" dances.

i'm not pushing my beliefs on you. this is the argument sub-forum, and i'm arguing. don't like it, don't read it.

Yes but there are some people, not including yourself, who aren't arguing religion, but rather pressing their beliefs on us and telling us we are wrong for thinking anything else. I respect everyone's beliefs no matter how pro-God or how Satanic, we just expected the same kind of respect.

CT Track wrote:Yes but there are some people, not including yourself, who aren't arguing religion, but rather pressing their beliefs on us and telling us we are wrong for thinking anything else. I respect everyone's beliefs no matter how pro-God or how Satanic, we just expected the same kind of respect.

i just think P2 should stop trying to prove God with science. i don't believe that science will ever prove or disprove God.

but yea i agree, everyone should be respected, no matter what they believe.

i think we should just stop all of this religious argument. you believe what you believe.

+1. its not like all this arguing about it going to get someone to change their religious views.

xc_babe09 wrote:+1. its not like all this arguing about it going to get someone to change their religious views.

no, but it will get people thinking.