Brian Sell-Talent or Hard work?

I think that is pretty much a good figure, except I would say 7% genetics. Let's say el g was genetically predisposed to being a good miler (vs a marathoner for instance) and ran a 3:43 which uses the maximum of his aerobic capacity and utilizes his unique muscle fiber ratio (which is most likely very close to that of which has been theorized to be optimum for a miler). A rough estimate was that out of the 7% possible genetic gain he could have, he had 6.7%. Now a person who is lacking the strong starting AC and fiber ratio (most likely close to 0% starting genetic predisposal) but trains for around 11 years (the average time it takes for an elite runner to hit their peak race), he should be able to run about a 4:02 mile. If someone can train that long with limited injuries, I doubt that they would be much slower than that.

This was just thrown together really quick, debate it or do whatever, I'll clear it up tomorrow so I can have a break from thinking about it lol.

Running 140+ mpw is a talent.

ProtestTheZero wrote:Running 140+ mpw is a talent.

yes?

AudienceOfOne wrote:

ProtestTheZero wrote:Running 140+ mpw is a talent.

yes?

So he is talent :/ It isn't like any of the other elites work any less than he does, he just happens to have the talent to run the higher volume.

but 140 mpw is also work that you have to build up to.

AudienceOfOne wrote:but 140 mpw is also work that you have to build up to.

Ya, but that is like saying all the other elites who can't run more than 100 mpw aren't working as hard. That isn't true, they are working as hard, they just aren't talented in such a way that they can handle 140. Luckily, they are talented enough to get 140 mpw results out of 100 mpw.

It is just a different kind of talent, but it is still better than what any of us could do.

what are you talking about? all of the olymic marathoners could handle 140 mpw. they just don't because they run -100mpw because that is better for them.

AudienceOfOne wrote:what are you talking about? all of the olymic marathoners could handle 140 mpw. they just don't because they run -100mpw because that is better for them.

I seriously doubt they all could handle the extra mileage the way Sell did.

His talent is thriving at 140 mpw, when others succeed at 100 mpw. He is able to get the same results out of higher mileage. You just said the other marathoners would get diminished results from that same mileage.

Hence, he is talented, because he can train effectively at a higher mileage.

Brian Sell was definitely talented. I believe he was part of a crappy high school program (and even a bad college program) so running the times he did off of less than 20 mpw is very impressive.

You have to be either a) EXTREMELY optimistic or b) foolish or c) very naive to think that all of the people in the Olympics today got there based on hard work alone. They do work very hard but are also blessed with a large amount of natural talent.

I don't remember which runner it was (I'm thinking Barbosa though) who was running mid to late 4s in middle school. They just showed up for the mile, and ran it in that time off of hardly any training at all. Another very talented girl was running early 6s before she even turned 10 (she was in elementary school).

Unfortunately, though we might say this to make ourselves feel good, even if we train for the next 10 years as hard as we can, the average person will not make the Olympics, probably not even the Olympic trials.

A quote that I believe was said to Pre by none other than a very famous coach:

"Your belief that you have no talent is the ultimate vanity. If you have no talent
then you have no limits, it's all an act of will. Your heart can
probably pump more blood than anyone else's on earth, and that takes talent.
The bones in your feet are so strong, it'd take a sledgehammer to break
'em. Be thankful for your limits, Pre, they're about as limitless as
they get in this life."

JYoung or something wrote:Brian Sell was definitely talented. I believe he was part of a crappy high school program (and even a bad college program) so running the times he did off of less than 20 mpw is very impressive.

You have to be either a) EXTREMELY optimistic or b) foolish or c) very naive to think that all of the people in the Olympics today got there based on hard work alone. They do work very hard but are also blessed with a large amount of natural talent.

I don't remember which runner it was (I'm thinking Barbosa though) who was running mid to late 4s in middle school. They just showed up for the mile, and ran it in that time off of hardly any training at all. Another very talented girl was running early 6s before she even turned 10 (she was in elementary school).

Unfortunately, though we might say this to make ourselves feel good, even if we train for the next 10 years as hard as we can, the average person will not make the Olympics, probably not even the Olympic trials.

A quote that I believe was said to Pre by none other than a very famous coach:

"Your belief that you have no talent is the ultimate vanity. If you have no talent
then you have no limits, it's all an act of will. Your heart can
probably pump more blood than anyone else's on earth, and that takes talent.
The bones in your feet are so strong, it'd take a sledgehammer to break
'em. Be thankful for your limits, Pre, they're about as limitless as
they get in this life."

so my dreams of being an elite someday are pretty much done before they were born?

Probably, TBQH.

You don't find elites who aren't immensely talented.

dude whats the point then? i might as well go back to football.

years of hard work will make you really good even without the good genes
years of hard work with the genes will make you elite

Running With Scissors wrote:years of hard work will make you really good even without the good genes
years of hard work with the genes will make you elite

how do u know if u have the genes or not though??
just because your parents or grandparents didnt participate in sports after highschool
means u dont have any idea of how they could have done.

AudienceOfOne wrote:what are you talking about? all of the olymic marathoners could handle 140 mpw. they just don't because they run -100mpw because that is better for them.

Most of them are running 120+ mpw. In Gebresselassie's build up to his WR in the marathon, he peaked at almost 160 mpw.

futureNIKErunner wrote:

Running With Scissors wrote:years of hard work will make you really good even without the good genes
years of hard work with the genes will make you elite

how do u know if u have the genes or not though??
just because your parents or grandparents didnt participate in sports after highschool
means u dont have any idea of how they could have done.

The secret is not worrying about it.

You are ridiculously insecure if you need to validate your worth as a runner in relation to others. Run because you like to run, and then, if you are going to be elite, you will be, if not you won't. You will never make it if you only run because you want to be elite.

Speaks the truth my friend.

i do believe a person can get pretty dang good at running with a lot of hard work. just not at a professionally-elite level. it would just take time, so join an elite track club or something when you get out of college. just don't give up when you can't go pro.

so is ilbrie gone yet?

P2 wrote:so is ilbrie gone yet?

hasn't come back from what i'm aware of.

nice lets keep it that way.

WAY OFF TOPIC BUT
http://track.flocasts.org/sellyoursellf/main

TnF_T wrote:WAY OFF TOPIC BUT
http://track.flocasts.org/sellyoursellf/main

lol

I don't agree that being able to run at 140 mpw is a talent. If anything, it is a curse that he is only as good as the other marathoners who train at 100 mpw. Dathan trains around there, and hall trains around 120. Not to mention, if I built up 15 extra miles every year, I could be there in just under 5 years safely. My highest mileage before this year was 45, maybe 50, and now I'm at 60 and it isn't even hard. I felt the best I did all summer after my 55 mile week, which was my new record at the time.